Racism in Porn

[member006]

Childish obviousness – my posting isn’t addressed.

This is a ‘moderator’ styled posting, which you have chosen to make for a posting that is controversial to you.

As I said, in the above posting, preference and oppression are not the same.

You are not an expert nor am I. You are voicing only opinion as everyone else here is, including myself.

I chose to make my post to say what I wanted to say. Nothing more nothing less. Seems you somehow think you have the right to say what you wish without disagreement or some type rebuttal posted from someone? Not everyone will agree because you say its so. You in no way can "moderate" that sir. Yet you say I posted a moderator style post?

I still feel its just a matter of personal preference is my opinion not a racial issue. Since none of us are there including myself and we can only state what we feel from what we do know and see. Then mix in a bit of our own thoughts. Did anyone stop and think maybe what the public has made of it, like we're doing here is the problem? That situations like this cause this type porn to be considered a "specialty" like so many others? Hence supply and demand, perhaps causing the women to demand more money to do this type porn and being refused leading to them saying "no way"? Money being the reason, not race.

This issue can be guessed on till the cows come home. I myself however don't see it as racism in porn, a pitiful "I'm oppressed" issue or any other such nonsense. Only personal choice or business decisions. Childish obviousness as my stern opposition has stated. All of the above IMHO only as always.

LL

 

[frodo60]

Well, having written all I consider as the most important about this topic, I'd like to add just a few marginal notes.

First, a brief summary:

- I claim that only a person considering people of different race(s) as inferior or subhuman and unable or not deserving to enjoy full individual rights is a racist.

- I claim that by refusing sex with a person of different race no right of the person refused are denied and therefore the refusal cannot be labelled as racist, although it is discriminating.

- I claim that it is up to the pornstars to make their money in the way most suitable according to their opinions and unless they offend anyone of different race, nobody has a reason to blame them for racism and they are in no way obliged to explain us why they have made their decisions.


Some marginal notes:

- Although some pornstars' having interracial sex off camera has been used in order to blame them for racism in this thread, it could actually be proof of the contrary: if one were a racist, one would probably avoid interracial sex completely (but as I said, I don't consider having or not having sex with a person of different race as saying anything about racism).

- I concede I may be wrong in the following, because I haven't seen many interracial scenes, but practically all I have watched seem to correspond to the stupid racist stereotype "a poor little white girl fucked by a black monster". I don't like this concept and I must admit that I've almost stopped watching interracial scenes due to it (I only hope there are films showing interracial sex in a more delicate and erotic way). From this point of view seems very ridiculous to me to blame a pornstar for racism due to her avoiding acting in racist stuff.

After reading your post, I have changed my mind. I now do not thing it is racist if one does not wish to have sex with another race.
This is due to what you said:
"I claim that by refusing sex with a person of different race no right of the person refused are denied and therefore the refusal cannot be labelled as racist, although it is discriminating."

I agree that it is not racism, BUT it is discrimination.

 

[calpoon]

Why not? If for example I changed it around and instead of people of other races I said could you see how somebody could find the entire grouping of women over the age of 100 unattractive could you believe it?

First of all I don't think that anyone finds centagenarians attractive, but whatever. that would be ageism. Also I think it's kind of wierd that you compare interacial sex to people with deformity. But yeah, all of those things are along the same lines. I wouldn't make that statement. bring me whatever fucked up person and i'll tell you if i'd fuck them or not. there's a difference between something that is very common, say like mixed race couples, and something that is not very common like people that have a fetish for having sex with lepers or saxophones.

it's only natural...Now, that doesn't mean I have anything against other races, I'm just not attracted to those races as much as I am to white girls and if I feel this way it's probably reasonable to assume that alot of people in the porn industry feel the same way.

eh. again with the natural. I don't want to talk about that... BUT you did say that you have been attracted to people of other races, but you generally prefer people of your own race. that's what I'm talking about. That's not racist. That's judging people by thier individual level of attractiveness, not based simply on what their race is.

I agree that it is not racism, BUT it is discrimination.

so discriminating against people based on thier race isn't racism?

 

[xxaru]

So xxaru, how many 100+ year old grandmothers are you willing to have sex with? If you aren't willing, does that mean you are just as bad as the racist?

Yes. Although it's an extreme case... It means that I would also be discriminating against them.

 

[Facial_King]

DRock said, "So xxaru, how many 100+ year old grandmothers are you willing to have sex with? If you aren't willing, does that mean you are just as bad as the racist?"

Well, as long as gotcha table-turning is fair game, how many 100+ year old grandmothers are willing to have sex with you...or anyone???

And, along another line that I've seen discussed here, it does seem hard to imagine that a woman would be willing to fuck Ron Jeremy, but then when some of these (often well-built, and I don't just mean in the dong dept.) black guys come along, they'd say, no, they're not attracted. It's just hard for me to fathom, personally....

:2 cents:

 

[member006]

Excellent post Jan. :thumbsup:

Rep for you and for everyone else's benefit please let me add this. Its because of the totally clear manner in which it was presented and not based on agreement or disagreement.

LL

 

[xxaru]

... but if someone with a fantastic body like Lex or Marcus...

Don't mean to get off topic here... but I wouldn't exactly call Lex's body "fantastic"; at least not from the pics I've seen. But that's just my opinion.:2 cents:

 

[xxaru]

OK OK, well Marcus has a great body. I know because my gf had her hands all over it and is in love with him.

And if this is what you want to hear, fine, I'll play along. Yes, you have a better body than Lex. And yes, you have a much better attitude. But can you fuck fine ass porn goddesses as intensely as him? Only time will tell. Bring it on.

Fox

I'm always up to a good challenge:thumbsup:

 

[xxaru]

BTW...
I’ve got a theory about porn. And maybe I’m wrong… but I think (as I’ve stated before) that a big part of the problem is that there are no really big time black female starlets. And on the other side of the spectrum, all of the black male stars sort of fit right into the mold that society, the industry, or whoever else has sort of carved out for them (which is the typical big black guy, that’s sort of seen as below his white counterparts, and is basically providing shock value of a huge cock and is often portrayed or advertised as animalistic in nature. Ex: Big black cocks on little white chicks, etc).

I think, that if the right black male and/or female performer (someone with superstar potential) came along to break the mold and set a new standard for black performers in porn, a lot of this idea of being tainted from doing interracial would dissipate. Again… this is just my theory. I could be WAY off:dunno:

 

[sammy402002]

Wait a minute "xxaru",but no black female starlets??--I disagree.Ariel Alexus is one of the most beautiful porn girls I have ever seen.Candace Von is plenty cute,"maybe a bit voluptuous for some",but I like Her ...and Jada Fire is super hot with body & personality.Sorry to keep beating the drum for Ariel Alexus,but I am in LUST with Her..

 

[xxaru]

Wait a minute "xxaru",but no black female starlets??--I disagree.Ariel Alexus is one of the most beautiful porn girls I have ever seen.Candace Von is plenty cute,"maybe a bit voluptuous for some",but I like Her ...and Jada Fire is super hot with body & personality.Sorry to keep beating the drum for Ariel Alexus,but I am in LUST with Her..

I wasn't saying that there were no black female starlets. I was saying that there were no "top" black female starlets. At least none that I know of:dunno: . I think there needs to be a black starlet on the same level of that of Brianna Banks, Tera Patrick, Jenna, etc. When you think of porn, those are some of the top girls that come to mind. A black starlet needs to be among those names if things are ever going to really change for them in the industry; IMO.

 

[sammy402002]

I wasn't saying that there were no black female starlets. I was saying that there were no "top" black female starlets. At least none that I know of:dunno: . I think there needs to be a black starlet on the same level of that of Brianna Banks, Tera Patrick, Jenna, etc. When you think of porn, those are some of the top girls that come to mind. A black starlet needs to be among those names if things are ever going to really change for them in the industry; IMO.

You are right.--I never liked Jenna all that much,but there will never be another Jenna.She seems to be a bussiness genius among a bunch of lost college girls.Good for Her.--I suppose the reason for that is that the black population is like 12 or 13 percent in the U.S.--Therefore;there are less black girls in the business.

 

[bunker]

I just saw this thread and started to read it from the last page, not that I am lazy or uninterested but there is already enough to talk about.

Racism in this business ? Sure like everywhere else.

Do we see it the movies ? In one category Yes, (I'll come back to that later) but for the rest NO, we can guess it more by what we don't see than what we see.

What we don't see that raises question ?
We don't se huge ebony stars (Not since Midori who was sometimes used as a 3rd or 4th girl in a scene with nameless white girls, or a 6 minutes badly lit scene in an all white girls well lit movie.) IMHO it is not only a question of statistics although that must be part of it.

We don't see them on the web. We never find information about these girls. Everey time I look for a Black girl I end up writing that we can't find anything about them. A euro cutie that did 4 photosets has more webpages and links about her that a Black girl that did 50 movies. Check for Black girls in the Freeones database... many well known black girls are not even there. Search the most popular ones in Google, besides ther own website and endless listings of interset sites where you can buy or look at movies, you won't find that much info. That's in America, now try to find somthing about Black girls in Europe!!!

We rarely see black girls on top of white girls in lesbos. In fact we don't see that much lesbos interracial scenes and the whities are most of the time predominant.

We rarely see black girls on top of white men in hetero.specially compared to the opposite situation.

And we even don't see many interracial scenes between White men and Black women. In fact I considered the word interracial as meaning a scene between a Black guy and a White girl. Why ? Because scenes like that don't sell. Porn is a busienss and must sell. The customers may force the industry to have some tendancies. Also maybe some Whte girls have cotracts with their agency that states they won't make interracial scenes. Lots of pornstars are escorts and many refuse to see Black guys.

This is just my own prejudices... but I'd like to know how much they are paid compare to White girls.

As long as the YES on top is concerned, I thnk we see it in Black porn. Blacks against whites. Racism is not a white man exclusivity.
IMHO The Now you're a slave or Bark like a dog or Blacks on blondes type of thing are not imposed by the business and the poor Black guy is condemned to play that role. Many Black porn businesses are managed by Black guys. They could show us something else, but they are doing it for the same reason I said above : it sells.. sells mainly to Black guys who wants to see that and a part of white clientele. The old fantasy (although based on a racist behavior they suffered) is still alive.

A reason why we may see it less in White production nowadays and why porn is more standardized than before is this : Altough porn is supposed to be a non-politically correct business, Whites are too conscious about the possibility of complaints and loss of some money. Most of the biggest American and European companies that do porn have now contracts with mainstream distribution companies (Warners is one of them. In the 90's porn was the fastest growing business in entertainment, dvd, internet, etc..., these guys wanted there share but they do have values) lol. So they won't show it clearly on the screen, while Black guys make money with it.

All that is IMHO and on top of my head... could be all wrong. I don't know how the business works but watching their products make me think this way.

Sorry for my English if there are too many mistakes or things not cleared, it is my second language.
:hatsoff:

 

[Member2019]

I agree, but disagree ...

I wasn't saying that there were no black female starlets. I was saying that there were no "top" black female starlets. At least none that I know of:dunno: . I think there needs to be a black starlet on the same level of that of Brianna Banks, Tera Patrick, Jenna, etc. When you think of porn, those are some of the top girls that come to mind. A black starlet needs to be among those names if things are ever going to really change for them in the industry; IMO.

First off, I have to somewhat agree. I mean, there is a clear bias against African American women in many "media" related avenues, especially if they are very dark skinned and not lighter. Especially in the mainstream media, although if you're not white male, you tend to be discriminated against in general (which is why those actors/actresses and other celebrities in the mainstream media tend to be far left, because their own industry is one of the most racist/sexist around).

But I utterly disagree that in many aspects of porn that this is the norm. At least for us "busty" lovers, we have Sierra (one of my favorite pornstars of all-time, hands down -- and probably my #1 pick in a pornstar to make love too based on how she is on-screen) and more recent lovers like Candice Von and Ms. Panther. Women who flaunt curves that are so extremely rare on a woman who is lighter/white (we only get white women shaped like Gianna in rare occasions).

But I love curves. In fact, I'm so addicted to curves that when it comes to mainstream actresses who are hot -- I have to mention "Queen Latifah" before anyone else. Why? Because curves are so taboo in mainstream media, and and even some in porn as well. So African American (or Anglo-African, etc...) women become a 'default staple' for myself, because it's not taboo for a black woman to be so in public.

I guess it is kinda bothersome that even thinner women, with curves, like Audree James or Alexis Silver or a few others aren't as popular. Or maybe they are becoming popular. But at least we do have Halle Berry who has broken into the top echelon in mainstream media -- and rightly so. Although she's still ligther and I'd question if she'd still be able to do so if she was darker.

Although I still have a far better chance for an African American to know who Esther Baxter is than your typical Caucasian American. And not that it matters, but I'm heavily Irish-American, and only have a hit of Cherokee that isn't European in my make-up. Outside my wife (Italian), I'd have to argue my best lover was an African American -- very dark, very curvy -- and I didn't give a shit who looked at us weird when we were together.

 

[Roughneck]

Sorry for my English if there are too many mistakes or things not cleared, it is my second language.
:hatsoff:

Damn! You have a better grasp of it than some of the kids in our local school - hell, probably better than mine! :hatsoff:

cheers,

 

[bunker]

Re: I agree, but disagree ...

But I utterly disagree that in many aspects of porn that this is the norm. At least for us "busty" lovers,
... I'd have to argue my best lover was an African American -- very dark, very curvy -- and I didn't give a shit who looked at us weird when we were together.

I won't hi-jack this thread to somewhere else, but I like this comment. I am not a boob lover myself (b-cup is great for me). But when I go through big boob threads and read what true booblovers wrote, I am always surprised to find that to all of them (I never read one guy saying the contrary) race, color, language, etc... are absolutely irrelevant and pointless. All barriers are down. They like the girl, whatever, that's all.

Does it proove that the industry doesn't discriminate in that particular category, I don't know ... but more important to me it shows that customers and fans don't and that is good news and nice to read and know. We all have lessons to take from you.:bowdown:

Booblovers are showing us the way. Seems like ' boobloving ' is the first (and only) true universal love:hatsoff:

 

[woy]

As a booblover I have to say I really don't care what the color of the woman is as long as she has a pretty face and I love her tits.

 

[xxaru]

Re: I agree, but disagree ...

But I utterly disagree that in many aspects of porn that this is the norm. At least for us "busty" lovers, we have Sierra (one of my favorite pornstars of all-time, hands down -- and probably my #1 pick in a pornstar to make love too based on how she is on-screen) and more recent lovers like Candice Von and Ms. Panther. Women who flaunt curves that are so extremely rare on a woman who is lighter/white (we only get white women shaped like Gianna in rare occasions).

But I love curves. In fact, I'm so addicted to curves that when it comes to mainstream actresses who are hot -- I have to mention "Queen Latifah" before anyone else. Why? Because curves are so taboo in mainstream media, and and even some in porn as well. So African American (or Anglo-African, etc...) women become a 'default staple' for myself, because it's not taboo for a black woman to be so in public.

I guess it is kinda bothersome that even thinner women, with curves, like Audree James or Alexis Silver or a few others aren't as popular. Or maybe they are becoming popular. But at least we do have Halle Berry who has broken into the top echelon in mainstream media -- and rightly so. Although she's still ligther and I'd question if she'd still be able to do so if she was darker.

I agree. However, I would consider the "busty" category to be more of a niche in the porn world, as opposed to the norm. That's not to say anything against the "busty" girls, but when people think of porn, they normally dont think of the girls from the busty category... they think of girls like Jenna.

Halle Berry is among the top echelon of Hollywood actresses and ALL black actresses (despite being of lighter complexion)... yet there are NO girls in the top echelon of porn that are even remotely like Halle Berry (at least none that I know of). Even in the fashion industry, which is often heavily favorable towards whites (I mean, look at who is on the cover of nearly every fashion magazine), you still have top echelon black girls like Naomi Campbell, Tyra Banks, Iman, etc, etc... But in porn there are absolutely no black actresses that are on that level.

With the men in Hollywood there are a number of black actors in the top echelon that are equal and even above their white male counterparts. So perhaps Hollywood has been more accepting of black males than of black females. And we also see black male performers in porn that I would consider to be in the upper echelon of the industry, but they all tend to fit right into the mold of the big black "monster" guy with a huge cock, etc. that the industry (or whoever else) has designed for them... and they are never really seen on the same level as their white counterparts.

 

[Member2019]

Curves (and not just "boobs") in the mainstream ...

First off, I guess I shouldn't have presented it as just "boobs." Although I would strongly argue there are more African American and Anglo African women of "hourglass" forms -- which tends to make their hips and bust expand with weight more than others -- than the typical Anglo American or other, European decent.

Secondly, as I used Queen Latifah as an example, she's not the ultimate, most busty African American on TV. She's just very full, very wide and I love those types of curves. I want an hourglass figure, and they are no where to be found most of the time in a celebrity. The rare time they are, it's often on an African American woman or -- better yet -- that "white woman black men want."

Yo! This white boy wants some of that too! Hell, some of my fellow white boys (and girls) are "bothered" by a brother wanting a full, white babe? Dude, those are my friends far more than others, because they understand me and what I like better!

As a booblover I have to say I really don't care what the color of the woman is as long as she has a pretty face and I love her tits.

There is certainly something to be said about oversized, massive, floppy breasts.
I'll fully admit it -- I had one African American lover, hourglass and shapely -- that I just totally lost it in minutes pumping between her massive, well beyond F-cup, flesh.
I was so selfish and all over those, it's safe to say that I didn't "last long" -- no matter how hard I tried to stay intimate and pace my focus -- once I started that action.

Other people want the bust when they are having intercourse to.

For me, I completely avoided intercourse for safe sex reasons (largely), although it's a good pair of fanging hips on an hourglass lovely that gets me.
In all honesty, I'm glad that babe and I didn't last -- I honestly think I wouldn't have been able to resist those perfect hips, thighs and ass -- and I would have lost it one time and just dipped it in.
And God forbid when you do dip it in -- and her curves are so fine -- your hands are debating whether they want to clasp her hips or her bust.

Luckily you have two hands, although she's still got a total of four (4) breasts and hip handles.

I won't hi-jack this thread to somewhere else, but I like this comment. I am not a boob lover myself (b-cup is great for me). But when I go through big boob threads and read what true booblovers wrote, I am always surprised to find that to all of them (I never read one guy saying the contrary) race, color, language, etc... are absolutely irrelevant and pointless. All barriers are down. They like the girl, whatever, that's all.
Does it proove that the industry doesn't discriminate in that particular category, I don't know ... but more important to me it shows that customers and fans don't and that is good news and nice to read and know. We all have lessons to take from you.:bowdown:
Booblovers are showing us the way. Seems like ' boobloving ' is the first (and only) true universal love:hatsoff:

Total. That and curves, the breasts don't always need to be large. But most of the time, because we prefer apple or hourglass shaped women, and not pear/spoon or straight shaped, the "boobs" are the bonus -- especially on the wider, fuller figure. It goes into their bust or bust and hips, and not just the hips.

I agree. However, I would consider the "busty" category to be more of a niche in the porn world, as opposed to the norm. That's not to say anything against the "busty" girls, but when people think of porn, they normally dont think of the girls from the busty category... they think of girls like Jenna.

Well, it's mainstream enough for me.

Halle Berry is among the top echelon of Hollywood actresses and ALL black actresses (despite being of lighter complexion)... yet there are NO girls in the top echelon of porn that are even remotely like Halle Berry (at least none that I know of). Even in the fashion industry, which is often heavily favorable towards whites (I mean, look at who is on the cover of nearly every fashion magazine), you still have top echelon black girls like Naomi Campbell, Tyra Banks, Iman, etc, etc... But in porn there are absolutely no black actresses that are on that level.

But don't forget all the fan-fare that Tocarra Jones garnered!
I would hit that in a second (if I wasn't married) -- wow!

With the men in Hollywood there are a number of black actors in the top echelon that are equal and even above their white male counterparts. So perhaps Hollywood has been more accepting of black males than of black females. And we also see black male performers in porn that I would consider to be in the upper echelon of the industry, but they all tend to fit right into the mold of the big black "monster" guy with a huge cock, etc. that the industry (or whoever else) has designed for them... and they are never really seen on the same level as their white counterparts.

But among even men, Don Cheadle is one of my favorite actors, and he never gets a lead role, always supportive.
Unless, of course, it's something like Hotel Rowanda.
You get more "action" and "motherfucker" types like Samuel L. Jackson (who is an outstanding actor, don't get me wrong, drama/Shakespear and everything).
Could I please get some less "hood" action and more "real," African American films?

Sorry, I don't agree Hollywood, it's not the viewership, its you.
If you'd stop catering to 25% of the market, you'd find you'd get more viewership.

 

[xxaru]

Re: Curves (and not just "boobs") in the mainstream ...

Well, it's mainstream enough for me.

But don't forget all the fan-fare that Tocarra Jones garnered!
I would hit that in a second (if I wasn't married) -- wow!

True. I take nothing away from those types of girls. But the media and society always tends to put them behind the typical model types. So until we can get the Naomi Campbell of porn, I see black starlets still being stuck in the background. Hopefully this can change somewhat with time.

But among even men, Don Cheadle is one of my favorite actors, and he never gets a lead role, always supportive.
Unless, of course, it's something like Hotel Rowanda.
You get more "action" and "motherfucker" types like Samuel L. Jackson (who is an outstanding actor, don't get me wrong, drama/Shakespear and everything).
Could I please get some less "hood" action and more "real," African American films?

Sorry, I don't agree Hollywood, it's not the viewership, its you.
If you'd stop catering to 25% of the market, you'd find you'd get more viewership.

I definitely agree about Don Cheadle (he's also one of my favorites), but I think Denzel Washington is a great example of the top echelon in Hollywood.